W. W. Greener
- Ww Greener Shotguns Serial Numbers For Sale
- Greener Shotgun Models
- W W Greener Shotgun Models
- Ww Greener Shotgun Serial Numbers
Ww Greener Shotguns Serial Numbers If I remember right, top rib marked 'W W Greener and Son works Birmingham'. The above is a greener GP gun, with a full-choke barrel fitted. The barrel below is Improved Cylinder choked, and has the same serial number as the gun and the full-choke barrel. Below that, is my greener EG police gun The martini action used for this series of shotguns is solid and generally very reliable.
From Graces Guide
Ww Greener Shotguns Serial Numbers For Sale
Greener Guns of St. Mary's Row, Birmingham. Telephone: Central 5733. Telegraphic Address: 'Greener, Birmingham'. (1937)
William Greener was the first generation of the Greener family gun makers, who started his career as an apprentice to John Gardner in Newcastle-Upon-Tyne.
Later, as a journeyman gun maker he worked for Joe Manton in London before marrying.
1829 He returned to Newcastle-Upon-Tyne and set up his own gun making business.
1844 He experienced difficulties in obtaining materials so in 1844 he moved to Birmingham and in, or near that city, the business has remained ever since.
William Greener was a prolific inventor and over his lifetime he invented: the expansive bullet (1835); an electric light (1846 - this was long before the modern 'Ediswan' lamp was patented in 1879); a device to open the four gates of a railway level crossing simultaneously; a self-righting lifeboat (1851) and modifications to the Miners Safety Lamp. But first and foremost he was a gun maker and the quality of his guns soon attracted the rich and famous; amongst these was Prince Albert, consort to Queen Victoria.
1851 At The Great Exhibition he won two gold medals and a diploma 'for guns and barrels, perfectly forged and finished' - the highest honour obtainable.
1855 He went on to win two silver medals at the Paris Exposition, but throughout his life he made percussion muzzle loaders and was sceptical of the new breech loaders, then in their infancy. William wrote three books, The Gun in 1834, The Science of Gunnery in 1846 and Gunnery in 1858 published in that year. He was instrumental in reforming the Gun Barrel Proof House in the Act of 1855 after a pamphlet, he produced in 1846, 'The Proof House - the Bane of the Trade' influenced politicians and the public to stamp out corruption and bad practices.
1869 After William's death, his second son, William Wellington Greener, continued to make high quality sporting and military guns. Like his father, he was also an inventor and many of his inventions helped to shape the breech-loader, which by that time was developing into the modern sporting gun we know today.
1875-79 Probably W. W. Greener's greatest contribution to gun making was perfecting the system of choke boring, which allowed him to win all The Field Trials from 1875 to 1879 and led to most wing shots using Greener guns to win prizes and competitions throughout the world. The perfection of choke boring and the famous cross-bolt (which he invented in 1873 to strengthen the action of breech loaders) are probably what he will be remembered for most.
1881 Like his father he wrote books - the most famous of which The Gun and its Development was published in 1881. This book, like The Breechloader and How to Use it, published in 1892, ran to nine editions.
1880s Gun, rifle and cartridge works.
1900 By the turn of the century, he had the world's largest sporting gun factory employing over four hundred and fifty skilled craftsmen.
1910 W. W. Greener's sons, Harry and Charles, took over the business.
1914 Specialities: High-class Guns, Medium Quality Guns, Sporting Rifles, Military Rifles, Rifle Club Rifles. [1]
1920 The firm was incorporated into a Limited Company.
WWI. Production was switched to military requirements during the war.
Post-WWI. During the period between the World Wars, demand for the very high quality sporting guns, which had been made between 1880 and 1914, diminished. The company under the two brothers, and later Leyton Greener, Harry's son, concentrated on well made, but less expensive 'Empire' models and the single barrel GP (General Purpose) shotgun, developed from a quasi-military riot control shotgun supplied to the Egyptian police force.
1937 Listed Exhibitor - British Industries Fair. Sporting Guns, Rifles, Ammunition, Police Guns, Air Rifles, Miniature Target and Big Game Rifles, Harpoon Guns, Cattle Killers, Cream-making Machines, Emulsifiers, Clay Pigeon Traps, Box Strapping Machines, Tubular Packing Boxes, Nuts, Bolts, Repetition Capstan Work. (Stand No. B.426) [2]
1937 Gun and rifle manufacturers. [3]
WWII. Production once again switched to military requirements during the war.
1961 Gun makers, engineers, bolt and nut manufacturers. 250 employees. [4]
1965 Webley and Scott acquired the gun-making side of the business[5], and continued to make the single barrel GP for a few years. The 'Greener' gun was used by riot police.
Greener Guns of St. Mary's Row, Birmingham. Telephone: Central 5733. Telegraphic Address: 'Greener, Birmingham'. (1937)
William Greener was the first generation of the Greener family gun makers, who started his career as an apprentice to John Gardner in Newcastle-Upon-Tyne.
Later, as a journeyman gun maker he worked for Joe Manton in London before marrying.
1829 He returned to Newcastle-Upon-Tyne and set up his own gun making business.
1844 He experienced difficulties in obtaining materials so in 1844 he moved to Birmingham and in, or near that city, the business has remained ever since.
William Greener was a prolific inventor and over his lifetime he invented: the expansive bullet (1835); an electric light (1846 - this was long before the modern 'Ediswan' lamp was patented in 1879); a device to open the four gates of a railway level crossing simultaneously; a self-righting lifeboat (1851) and modifications to the Miners Safety Lamp. But first and foremost he was a gun maker and the quality of his guns soon attracted the rich and famous; amongst these was Prince Albert, consort to Queen Victoria.
1851 At The Great Exhibition he won two gold medals and a diploma 'for guns and barrels, perfectly forged and finished' - the highest honour obtainable.
1855 He went on to win two silver medals at the Paris Exposition, but throughout his life he made percussion muzzle loaders and was sceptical of the new breech loaders, then in their infancy. William wrote three books, The Gun in 1834, The Science of Gunnery in 1846 and Gunnery in 1858 published in that year. He was instrumental in reforming the Gun Barrel Proof House in the Act of 1855 after a pamphlet, he produced in 1846, 'The Proof House - the Bane of the Trade' influenced politicians and the public to stamp out corruption and bad practices.
1869 After William's death, his second son, William Wellington Greener, continued to make high quality sporting and military guns. Like his father, he was also an inventor and many of his inventions helped to shape the breech-loader, which by that time was developing into the modern sporting gun we know today.
1875-79 Probably W. W. Greener's greatest contribution to gun making was perfecting the system of choke boring, which allowed him to win all The Field Trials from 1875 to 1879 and led to most wing shots using Greener guns to win prizes and competitions throughout the world. The perfection of choke boring and the famous cross-bolt (which he invented in 1873 to strengthen the action of breech loaders) are probably what he will be remembered for most.
1881 Like his father he wrote books - the most famous of which The Gun and its Development was published in 1881. This book, like The Breechloader and How to Use it, published in 1892, ran to nine editions.
1880s Gun, rifle and cartridge works.
1900 By the turn of the century, he had the world's largest sporting gun factory employing over four hundred and fifty skilled craftsmen.
1910 W. W. Greener's sons, Harry and Charles, took over the business.
1914 Specialities: High-class Guns, Medium Quality Guns, Sporting Rifles, Military Rifles, Rifle Club Rifles. [1]
1920 The firm was incorporated into a Limited Company.
WWI. Production was switched to military requirements during the war.
Post-WWI. During the period between the World Wars, demand for the very high quality sporting guns, which had been made between 1880 and 1914, diminished. The company under the two brothers, and later Leyton Greener, Harry's son, concentrated on well made, but less expensive 'Empire' models and the single barrel GP (General Purpose) shotgun, developed from a quasi-military riot control shotgun supplied to the Egyptian police force.
1937 Listed Exhibitor - British Industries Fair. Sporting Guns, Rifles, Ammunition, Police Guns, Air Rifles, Miniature Target and Big Game Rifles, Harpoon Guns, Cattle Killers, Cream-making Machines, Emulsifiers, Clay Pigeon Traps, Box Strapping Machines, Tubular Packing Boxes, Nuts, Bolts, Repetition Capstan Work. (Stand No. B.426) [2]
1937 Gun and rifle manufacturers. [3]
WWII. Production once again switched to military requirements during the war.
1961 Gun makers, engineers, bolt and nut manufacturers. 250 employees. [4]
1965 Webley and Scott acquired the gun-making side of the business[5], and continued to make the single barrel GP for a few years. The 'Greener' gun was used by riot police.
1967 The building of the inner ring road in Birmingham meant the factory complex fronting St Mary's Square had to go, so in 1967 the company was sold, the old factory with its imposing Victorian edifice was pulled down and production for the company as a family run business ceased.
1985 The company was bought its present owners; Graham Greener, W. W. Greener's great grandson, David Dryhurst and Richard Tandy, two of the country's finest gunmakers and Ken Richardson who made accessories for the gun trade. In the next couple of years important decisions were made which resulted in a return to making best quality sporting guns once again.
1987 To promote this, Graham Greener decided to build the 'New St. George' 12 bore side-lock. This design was chosen as the company was now making very best quality side-locks again and the lock plates provided a large area for some very special chiselled relief engraving of St. George and the Dragon.
1992 Finished and engraved by Alan and Paul Brown, this gun led to many orders being placed for similar models, and sets of guns ranging from 28 to 12 bores in the years that followed.
See Also
Sources of Information
- ↑1914 Whitakers Red Book
- ↑1937 British Industries Fair Page 370
- ↑1937 The Aeroplane Directory of the Aviation and Allied Industries
- ↑1961 Dun and Bradstreet KBE
- ↑The Times, 1968
- [1] Shooting Party
- Birmingham's Industrial Heritage by Ray Shill. Published by Sutton Publishing 2002. ISBN 0-7509-2593-0
Greener Shotgun Models
If I remember right, top rib marked 'W W Greener and Son works Birmingham'. Barrel marked. Serial Number 185**. That number would put it at 1877 when 1,500 guns were made by Greener that year.
W W Greener Shotgun Models
The 'mark' variations are to do with the way that the pins through the cation are secured. On an original GP they are held by retaining screws that have to be undone. In a 'Mark II' by circlips. There are also Webley assembled GPs after they took over Greener. Some will have used Greener barrels with a 'knox form' others a standard shot gun barrel with no 'knox form'. These can be found with and without the circlips.Circlips was an abomination added by Webley's when they took over the manufacture of the guns in 1965. MK I was a police gun in 13 bore MK II was a police gun in special 14 bore-restricted chamber MKIII was a police gun with a three prong striker.
Now while researching this I came across this bit of info on the GP. GP is is for Gaffer or General purpose shotgun. According to Greeners book the exact number of GP shotguns made is impossible to be determined as the serial numbers of these shotguns were not recorded untill 1968. If your gun is a Police gun then the serial number look up I did for you is correct. If your gun is a GP then it's not possible to determine the date made by serial number. Two models of GP are referenced.
Standard model has no checkering and a barrel band. The second model had a better finish, checkering and looked more like a sporting weapon, The Greener Story by Graham Greener has a lot more on this gun and other Greener arms. Luchshij sbornik francuzskoj estradi.
The book is a bit spendy but I have found it quite useful in my Martini hobby. There are contradictions in the book. The text makes no mention of a MK designation in GP's. It refers to the checkerd version as Model number 2.
A picture directly below the text of a checkered stock model is titled The Greener GP Mk I You should be able to look at the side of the action and see what it says to determine if you have GP or a police gun. The date that the gun was sent to British Proof Test can be found out. Look on the side of the barrel and there will be a code. It will have been so marked within a few weeks, certainly the same year, it was finished.
It may have remained in stock with Greener (or Webley) but that will date its year of manufacture. If you visit Greener GP Mk II does exist as a Webley made version, with circlips, of the standard civilian GP. They are quite awful but also quite rare.
However that does not automatically confer value! Yours if it is a GP and not an 'EG' or 'Police Gun' will be the standard GP that wasn't in its civilian version given a 'Mark' number.
Ww Greener Shotgun Serial Numbers
Only in civilian guise the 'Mark II'. Here is a picture of one with those typical Webley features of no knox form on the barrel.
